The only reason Ganking Hulks is profitable is the fact that Miners are too lazy to tank their ships.

Now, they won't have to do anything to do so.

A properly fit Hulk cannot be profitably ganked.

Also, I just thought of something. If suicide-ganking wasn't meant to be profitable, wouldn't it make more sense to simply remove T2 salvage from exhumer wrecks, instead of giving them more EHP than the average armor-buffer T3 pvp fit?


So you equate my promise that I will adapt to these changes and continue my activities to whining? Way to grasp at straws, little buddy.


You most definitely will if marketing tells you to.

Pray tell, why do you think this?

Ganking-for-profit and/or making a "career" of same is arguably one of the last few remaining examples of truly emergent gameplay left in hisec, IMHO.

You've nerfed everything else into the ground, and the more pants-on-head ("Suspect-flag" but "suspect" can't shoot back without sec-loss and/or CONCORDokken--What. The. F-word????!!!) aspects of the proposed Crimewatcg thingy look to only make this effectively carved in stone if implemented.

No, really:

No troll, dead serious:

Why do you think this?

Nerfing emergent gameplay is very bad, OK?

The only "profitable" ganking was untanked, max-yield cargo-expanded hulks and mackinaws. If someone was to pay people to keep all miners out of the belts, that was possible too (Blue Ice interdiction is the most memorable case).



Nope. The barge buff means that it is much harder to blow up mining ships, which means that you'll need to pay people a lot more money to keep your competition out of the belts. Along with this will be a fall in the value of minerals, so it won't be worth as much to you to get the competition out of the belts.



Yet datacore harvesting was moved to FW to make FW profitable for the participants. Faction warfare is profitable if you're not stupid about losing ships. PvP is always profitable if you can get more ISK from the other pilot's loot and salvage than it cost you to blow up that ship.

Now feel free to complain that I've quoted you out of context.

*miner launches medium ECM drones and permajams one of the catalysts, flubbing the gank entirely*

First, I don't grant your premise. Nobody has a monopoly on building Hulks.

That said,

Yep*. Yep.

*If they continue to refuse to fit a tank. A Hulk can be tanked such that it is unprofitable to gank it in any sec band. Untanked, it's profitable in most sec bands.

Well it had half the Hulk tank for years, time for some revenge.

But joking aside, mining ships like that will fall in the same category of the others: you kill them because of an agenda or because they are pimped or because they are carrying valuable stuff. Not because it's completely free ISK even killing the bare hull.

Nice, weak little straw-man, used as an even weaker little appeal to authority, bru. Fail.

If the devs really thought that it was "exploitative," then they would have declared it an exploit--because CCP has shown that they really don't like that sort of thing, as well they shouldn't--with the appropriate penalties for exploiting, and/or hard-mechanic fixing so it's not even do-able (ref.: The utterly senseless hard-nerf of the OPs "Tornado Bootlegger's Turn" manoeuvre).

This has not happened now, nor has it ever. There is also nothing explicitly even implying that it will, that has been said by anyone with a blue tag by their avatar.

Learn to debate.

Next!

E:

I want to hear Soundwave's answer to this, not some fluffy/squishy little WoW-kid's answer who thinks that EVE should be like WoW so that he doesn't have to use brain or ::effort:: to succeed in it.

Step 1: Halve Concord Response time, triple the sec status penalty. (ganker nerf)

Step 2: Create the Noctis - destroying ninja income by crashing the value of salvage.

Step 3: Kill the LVL 4 Loot, while leaving 'unstealable' bounties untouched. (ninja nerf)

Step 4: Two stealth nerfs of the Orca's abilities, specifically so ninjas cannot benefit from them. (ninja nerf)

Step 5: End enforcement of alliance hopping exploits. (merc nerf)

Step 6: Remove insurance, but only for gankers, while leaving it in place for self-destruction. (ganker nerf)

Step 7: Screw up RR and aggression flags, then provide helpful popups so nobody can hurt an Incursion bear. (Skunkworks)

Step 8: Dramatically reduce the time and effort it takes to set-up or break-down a POS. (merc nerf)

Step 9: Buff Concord by preventing pirates from boarding or bailing out of ships while GCC'd. (Smodab Ongalot nerf)

Step 10: Buff Concord again, by making them appear instantly to prevent warping while GCC'd. (Herr Wilkus nerf)

Step 11: Huge increase of wardec costs, while allowing free allies and unrestrained corp-dropping to the defender. (mercs)

Step 12: Insane barge buff. (ganker nerf)

Step 13: Crimewatch (major nerf to hauler/freighter ganking and ninjas)

Step 14: Who knows? Instant Concord death ray? Quoting some fool in FF 2012: "Pewww!"

And thats just high-sec.....I'm not even going to start a list of punitive measures taken against a certain nul-sec Alliance that will remain nameless.

Factor in statements from DEVS, on this very thread: Quotable Winners like "Suicide ganking wasn't designed to be profitable", or "Gankers are expected to lose more than the victim..."

Its pretty clear where these steps are taking us.........

A change only "necessary" because miners adamantly refused to adapt for ... counting on my fingers... 5 years of Hulkageddons?

If miners had adapted to the situation, and gankers were crying, I'd be laughing at them. But that's not the situation. CCP has stepped in (yet again) because Miners cried loud and long that they were too lazy to adapt. CCP has decided to reward that.

why do you want a risk-free hisec

tell me that

hint: they're not going to cost more to replace than what it costs to gank them even after 1.1

let's see

crimewatch, which will prevent you from ganking a freighter or an officer-fit faction battleship because otherwise looting it means that anyone can shoot you and bring all the neutral RR they want and you can't shoot at their RR

this unnecessary change catering to afk miners who feel entitled to profit while only alt-tabbing from their movie to move ore to their orcas

yeah, welcome to a risk-free hisec. a new game enhancement - err, experience!

"Killing miners when fitted for their role"

translates to

"I don't have to tank because I don't believe Exhumers were meant to tank. Therefore it is unfair when a Catalyst blows one up for a minimal cost..."

Sorry, not a compelling argument.

Yeah, and Bad for Miners.

I was for the Drone Poo nerf as well. Mining shouldn't be the worst profession in EVE by such a large margin. It should be halfway decent.

I just find it weird that Miners keep wanting their profession to be easier and don't seem to get that that ease that they're calling for will hurt their income.

OK, so people are laughing at you because EHP is the HP which includes the resists, but I won't derail and will instead make the point clearer.

I can make a Vindicator do ~2000 dps and have 5 90% webs, which would make it most efficient in it's role. Sadly, it would only have 45k EHP and so 4 or 5 Catalysts fit for 1mil a piece could take down my 1.5bil battleship in highsec, as I autopiloted to my destination.

However, you are more likely to see people fitting what is commonly known as a "tank" to their ships; this is when you add to the EHP or self rep capability. When you do this, it will break 200k EHP with ease. Sadly, it will no longer do as much DPS (1200-1300) which means you are gimping it's role by at least 40%

Apparently, asking a miner to do what every one else does in the game is just TOO GOSH DARN hard.

You are not a special case, you're just bad at EvE. Taking your 200mil ship and NOT TANKING IT is silly.

Unfortunately, that doesn't work. Obviously. Turn on your brain for a second.

Why? With your half baked solution (AKA; take anything but AFK mode+EHP!!!)
.....lower the Mack's yield and you end up with this:

Yield: Hulk>Skiff>Mack
Cargo: Mack>Skiff>Hulk
EHP: Skiff>Mack>Hulk

Hulk at 1-3-3.
Mack is 1-2-3
and Skiff is 1-2-2.

Hulk remains the worst in 2 of the 3 categories.

The simplest way to do it is swap the EHP of the Hulk with the Mackinaw.
Then each Exhumer is.... best in one category, 2nd in another, and worst in the last.

Besides, its elegant: the 'easymode' temptation to AFK mine is balanced with higher vulnerability to ganking.

Still, I'll give you credit, Yokai: Its clear you've accepted our premise that the Exhumers are badly balanced and need a revision.